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Topic: Can't do, can't see (Read 8312 times) previous topic - next topic
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Can't do, can't see

One of the most prominent and most enforced "rules" of SMF is: if you can't do something, you should not be able to see anything about it.

Though, several people ask for such kind of behaviour.

I don't like it myself, I usually run away from anything that shows me a "preview" and then asks me to register in order to see what's next (unless I don't have any other choice and I have a strict and important deadline), though I understand I'm not remotely close to the mentality of the rest of the world.

So, what's your take on the point?

Should ElkArte "at some point" be able for example to show the board name, but not allow to enter? Or should be able to show the subjects of the topics, but not read the content (<= this has many implications, much more than board names, I know), or show the preview for the attachments, but not the full-size image? And so on?

Strong no?
Weak no?
Don't care?
Yes, but only ...?
Yes anything you can think of, configurable by membergroups with allow/deny and any other fancy permission you can imagine?
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Re: Can't do, can't see

Reply #1 –

I've seen enough requests for this that I don't see a problem with it. I probably would only allow preview of latest topic at board index level. And maybe view messageindex but not display template.
Success is not the result of spontaneous combustion, you must set yourself on fire!

Re: Can't do, can't see

Reply #2 –

I'm a strong don't know.

I can see the desire for something like this, its almost like different levels of guest access.  My concern would be I feel its just going to be adding to admin confusion.  I think most are already confused by permissions and what members can see / access , as such adding another layer of potential mistakes or confusion just seems wrong to me.  Perhaps if the interface was very clear, but ...

Hey anyone else notice there are two eyes in the BBC buttons, I'm being stared at :P

Re: Can't do, can't see

Reply #3 –

Quote from: Spuds – Hey anyone else notice there are two eyes in the BBC buttons, I'm being stared at :P
 emanuele wants a nose and a tongue as well! :P
Bugs creator.
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Re: Can't do, can't see

Reply #4 –

 TE feels "Don't care?"

Quote from: Spuds – Hey anyone else notice there are two eyes in the BBC buttons, I'm being stared at :P
ROFL, that's cool..
Thorsten "TE" Eurich
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Re: Can't do, can't see

Reply #5 –

You're right @emanuele , several people ask for such kind of behaviour!
Because of that, configurable by membergroups with allow/deny could be an plus opposite to SMF.
Therefore, I'm all for it.

Re: Can't do, can't see

Reply #6 –

My 2c: bloat. Better as a mod. :D
Master of Expletives: Now with improved family f@&king friendliness! :D

Sources code: making easy front end changes difficult since 1873. :P

Re: Can't do, can't see

Reply #7 –

no difference for me, I have almost everything visible to guests, except the Off-Topic & Garage board
sorry for my bad english

Re: Can't do, can't see

Reply #8 –

I hate how crap that does that can pollute search results and I like the SMF way. But it's a weak no because if someone wants to waste their time implementing that… eh, who am I to say no. :P

Re: Can't do, can't see

Reply #9 –

I think it causes more problems than its worth. It's a Weak No from me, mostly because I'm sure there's some use case (or insistent-enough admin) to warrant its implementation. But I'd much rather see it as a mod than as a core feature of Elkarte.

Honestly, I see it more as someone's means to start (or measure their status in) a pissing match. "Oh, look, here's this forum you can't access." What possible benefit do I get from knowing there's something I can't access? As a guest, if the only barrier is registration, that's one thing. But as a member, when the barriers are not so simple, it smacks of arrogance.

So maybe this is better just as a guest-only feature. Let certain BBCodes and boards be previewed, but not accessible, to guests. Don't screw with members.

Re: Can't do, can't see

Reply #10 –

IMO, I agree with you emanuele.  Though it would be good to understand the reasoning for a teaser preview.  What positive can come from seeing something but can't do it?  Seriously, someone please explain it, with a good example.  :)

Re: Can't do, can't see

Reply #11 –

That's not something I have idea right now, but I guess someone may come up with a forum similar to fotolia or shutterstock where people can post high-res images, but users are allowed to see them only through a paid subscription[1].

Of course, each and every piece can have different potential reasoning behind, so it's difficult to formulate a catch-all hypothesis. :P
1 just an example that I put together while writing, I didn't analyse the business model or whatever, that's beyond the point.↵
Bugs creator.
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Re: Can't do, can't see

Reply #12 –

Quote from: emanuele – Of course, each and every piece can have different potential reasoning behind, so it's difficult to formulate a catch-all hypothesis. :P

Understood.  Thanks for the offering.  :)

Re: Can't do, can't see

Reply #13 –

Quote from: emanuele – Or should be able to show the subjects of the topics, but not read the content (<= this has many implications, much more than board names, I know)

I know a few forums, where you just can read the subjects of the topics (maybe also a little preview of the first post), if you are not registered. You see nothing else. No Boards, no topics, maybee a very few pictures.  I don't like it, but it will give me a first impression of the forum, so I can decide, if I want to register or not. It is better than to see nothing as a guest. 

Some of those forums dont't allow you to register anyway, You have to send an email to the admin and beg him for creating an account for you, but first you have to tell your real name and the number of your phone. ::)  And you will get one or more calls :o  from the admin or a member of the team, before they allow you to see or write anything in their forum.

In our forum guests do not see a lot, they just see a very few topics and they are not allowed to see the attachments. I would like to show them much more, but most of our members would not agree with this. They dont want to be this much in the public, don't want to show everyone all their collecting items and they don't want to share their pictures and their knowledge with everyone.

So maybe, if guests could read the subjects of all the recent topics in our forum (just in the portal , without seeing all boards of the forum) it would be a possibility for us to show them a little more. Maybe they get more interessted to register.

In my second forum guests can almost read everything, but they don't see the attachments. If they register and have written a few posts, they will also see the off topic boards. I prefer it that way. But this is a  completely different forum, it is not neccesary to keep the members and their posts "safe", everyone can know, what we were talking about there.

I think, if you show everything to the guests, most of them will not register and will never take part of your forum. If you show nothing or only a very few parts of the forum, they will also not register.